I recently had the opportunity to be a guest on the Say Grace Podcast with Steve Palmer—someone I deeply respect in the industry.
We talked about leadership. But not the textbook kind.
We talked about vulnerability. Expectations. Getting it wrong. And getting better.
This clip is one moment from that conversation, but the whole thing is worth hearing.
If you want to listen to the full episode, you can find it on the Say Grace Podcast.
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